Books 2&3

[lizzardgirl]

Book 2: Gaudy Night, by Dorothy L. Sayers

Hm, yeah, I don't know whether I can say anything new about this since I discussed it before ;-) Oh yeah: HELL YES INTELLIGENCE *IS* SEXY. Also, I just love, love, love so many little details in this book and while reading I always love looking forward to them. Like when Harriet realises that Peter took her gown per accident, and then decides it doesn't really matter. Because it also signifies that Harriet realises - and that she realises Peter saw it this way all along - that as far as education and university rank go, they are equals, and that they could meet as equals in a marriage. Or when Miss de Vine tells Harriet it's bloody obvious she's in love with Peter. Or about every time Peter is happy when Harriet doesn't rebuff him. And the punt scene of course. So much the punt scene. I always have to restrain myself almost physically not to skip ahead to the punt scene and Peter's underlying elation afterwards. Also, Katharine was right, of course now I have to read Busman's Honeymoon too. Also it's made me all excited about the book about the development of university education for women that I borrowed from Caroline but haven't started yet, because Gaudy Night always makes me wish I could attend an Oxford women's college in the 1930s.

Book 3: The Secret Life of Bletchley Park, by Sinclair McKay

For all intents and purposes, this should be #2 because I read all but the last ten pages or so before I started Gaudy Night. It was a very interesting read and quite illuminating in some ways. (I also realise that some of the Bletchley allusions I made in Blackout wouldn't really have worked that way, but since I never named Bletchley in the story, I think I can get away with that :D) One thing I missed a little was - since I used to be quite proficient in Maths in another lifetime - a more mathematical analysis of how the codes were cracked and how the enigma encoding and decoding actually works. I had the feeling the author was a bit out of his depths there. But I can't really find a fault with that since the book never promised anything mathematical ;-) I'll just have to find Simon Singh's book on secret codes and then see if maybe the library has something more about enigma codes. I'll probably not get all of it but I'd like some more mathematical insights all the same. But apart from that, it was a really fascinating book! Thanks Caroline for lending it!

Comments

[brightly-woven.livejournal.com]

My biggest beef with Audible and my library's audiobook collection is that there is not an audiobook of GN and BH available, as that is my preferred method of reading.

ACK.

May just have to pull out the old paper copies from their dusty shelf.

:)

[brightly-woven.livejournal.com]

Good news--all of LPW is on kindle unlimited, which has pushed me back over the edge to joining up again.

[lizzardgirl.livejournal.com]

Ooooh ... I almost bought the ones I don't yet have in English (I know, I know) for kindle (I don't have a kindle, but eh, who cares) but then I realised I really do want to have a dead tree copy of them.

[katharhino.livejournal.com]

I succumbed and am now halfway through GN myself. SIGH. Peter has just shown up in Oxford and I'm shivering with delight. I just love those scenes when Harriet starts to realize that Peter can meet the Oxford side of her equally. Or the letter he sends her when he DOESN'T tell her to take care of herself, which on this reread, I think is the actual first crack in her armor. SIGH. LORD PETER.

By the way, you've read this, right? http://archiveofourown.org/works/47057 It's pretty much canon as far as I'm concerned and I plan to read it as soon as I'm done with GN and then transition seamlessly to BH.

Seriously, I had so many other books I had already started and I'm just dropping everything to wallow in Peter and Harriet. It's most annoying and wonderful.

[lizzardgirl.livejournal.com]

Hah, I knew I'd forgotten something! I wanted to include a rec for that fic in my post ;-)

She's also written other amazing LPW fic!

I think the crack in her armour is even earlier? When she realises she doesn't want Peter shot dead by some gunmen, or lose him for her own better comfort after the nasty letter he sees?

During all these scenes when they negotiate the relationship, part of me wants to smash their heads together and yell 'KISS ALREADY' and the other half is like 'd'awwwwww'

[katharhino.livejournal.com]

Well, crack in the armor is perhaps the wrong phrase. I think that letter is the first moment she actually thinks it might work. So it's more like the crack in her intellectual armor. The concern for his safety is earlier but more instinctual. And oh yes, the instant recognition of his beautiful hands... *SIGH*

I did forget about the scene in the restaurant over the nasty letter, though. That is part lovely and part hilarious. "Okay, I'm leaving then." "UM WAIT I know I said leave, but..."

[lizzardgirl.livejournal.com]

Oooh I have so many things I want to say when we discuss Harriet's emotional journey (also see comment to Meg below about Phoebe) but no time right now ... but we must delve into Harriet's feelings and possible chinks in the armour in-depth later! :D We must dissect everything and then dissect Peter's reaction to it, the better to squee about Peter!

[katharhino.livejournal.com]

OKAY IT'S A PLAN!!!!!

[lizzardgirl.livejournal.com]

Or when she meets St George and realises she kinda has a physical affinity for Peter's hand and voice. And that with St George and his massive debts and the massively incompetent Denvers, not all is really all that awesome in Peter-world, as she previously thought (and resented).

[brightly-woven.livejournal.com]

Succumbed as well. Only just started. Lovely.

Read wikipedia about DLS. I didn't know she had a child out of wedlock and he was raised by her aunt and cousin.

She is such a fascinating woman! I think a DLS biopic could be fabulous.

I've read that fanfic but thanks for the suggestion. Will read between GN and BH.

[lizzardgirl.livejournal.com]

She is fascinating! There's supposed to be a rather good biography about here somewhere, by Barbara Reynolds if I remember correctly, but I haven't got around to tracking it down so far. (So many books, so little time ...)

Also, haha, sucked you in! ;-)

[katharhino.livejournal.com]

I know practically nothing about DLS herself, but after rereading Mind of the Maker last year and now this, I'm really interested in finding out more about her. I know you should never assume a character is autobiographical, and she rebukes people who do that very thoroughly in MotM... but surely some parts of Harriet are reflective of DLS herself? I mean, just in her writing she comes across as scarily brilliant and uncompromising, much like Harriet... (And I mean scary literally. I think she must have been an extremely intimidating person.)

[brightly-woven.livejournal.com]

HA! This is a new favorite quote. Haven't read this since my kids were little, and wouldn't have dared even thought it then, but it's really quite true, in a totally un-politically correct sort of way, "All the children seem to be coming out quite intelligent, thank goodness. It would have been such a bore to be the mother of morons, and it’s an absolute toss-up, isn’t it? If one could only invent them, like characters in books, it would be much more satisfactory to a well-regulated mind.”

If I could have invented my children, though, I think I wouldn't have done half as good a job. Only Aidan wouldn't be quite such an Eeyore.

[lizzardgirl.livejournal.com]

You know, I think it's a shame we didn't see more of Phoebe in the book. But of course with that sort of no-nonsense and unconventional approach to all sorts of things she'd probably just have said a few pointed things to make Harriet realise not only who the poison pen is, but also that she's fancying Peter somewhat rotten, and then where would the novel have been?

But just the idea of Phoebe and her archeologist husband living and digging and raising children on equal terms together makes me giddy. Maybe that was what gave Harriet the subconscious seed of the idea that a marriage between equals could actually work.

[katharhino.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's even subconscious. I think she recognizes Phoebe has an equal marriage. But at that point, she thinks it's almost impossible to achieve one, and certainly it's not possible for her and Peter.

[lizzardgirl.livejournal.com]

Yes, I think you are right, and I worded that sloppily. I meant, she notices - consciously - that Phoebe and Mr Phoebe have an equal marriage, and a part of her subconsciously wants that too, but because she is not yet in a mental place where she'd actively consider being married to Peter, or would be open to any possibility of it working, she doesn't acknowledge that the fact that Phoebe has an equal marriage with a man who is her (intellectual) equal, means that it could be theoretically possible for her and Peter to work too, if she wanted to give it a chance.

But yeah, Harriet first has to enter a stage of mind where she won't instantly dismiss the idea of marriage to Peter. Not least because, with his constant proposing, saying no has become an automatic response for her where she doesn't even think about what to say, but only how to say it. But some time during her stay in Oxford, her mental state changes and she begins to see Peter - and more importantly, marriage to Peter - in a completely different light. Maybe it all starts with his letter (as you referenced above) and gets more momentum when she sees him in his gown, and then later that day realises that it doesn't really make a difference whether it's her gown or his. (Someone on the LPW mailing list, I think, once pointed out that in the 1930s, only an academic gown and a bathing suit would be garments that a man and a woman could ever have the same, which I think is a very intriguing thought. We don't really think about it because these days, it's so common to borrow each other's t-shirts etc. But it's fascinating that only in a garment that is essentially nothing but the naked body (even with the legs and straps and what-not of 1930s bathing suits) and the other for the university member, men and women can be equal. But I digress.) So I think the thought that when stripped of all else, in Oxford she and Peter will both be M.A.s who took a First, is what first makes her think about them as equals. And then of course on the punt later that afternoon she realises that she totally wants his hot body ;-)